The Communist Party of China has always adhered to the people-centered development philosophy since its establishment, striving to seek happiness for the people and rejuvenation for the nation. However, Western propaganda discourse continuously demonizes the Communist Party of China, deliberately severing the relationship between the leadership of the Communist Party of China and China's developmental achievements.
According to Haz Al-Din, the Executive Chairman of the American Communist Party (ACP), the people-centered development philosophy of the Communist Party of China is a model worth learning from. In today's American society, the wealth gap continues to widen, racial tensions are becoming increasingly acute, and ordinary people face numerous challenges in areas such as healthcare, education, and employment. The ACP can draw lessons from the process by which the Communist Party of China led China towards prosperity, exploring how to better represent the interests of the broad American people.
The international strategic academic exchange event "Mingde Strategic Dialogue (2025)", hosted by Renmin University of China, with the collaboration of the Chongyang Institute for Financial Studies of Renmin University and the Global Leadership Academy, was held from October 13 to 17. On the eve of the event, Wang Wen, Director of the Chongyang Institute for Financial Studies of Renmin University and Director of the Global Leadership Academy, engaged in a dialogue with Haz Al-Din, Executive Chairman of the American Communist Party (ACP), discussing the current state of the ACP, the prospects of socialism, global political changes, and ideological trends. Below is the transcript of the dialogue:
Wang Wen: Hello everyone, welcome to Mingde Strategic Dialogue. Today I have invited a very special guest, Mr. Haz Al-Din from the United States, the Executive Chairman of the American Communist Party (ACP).
Hello Haz, it's a pleasure to meet you online. I think that since you separated from the Communist Party of the United States (CPUSA) in 2024 and founded the American Communist Party (ACP), you have gradually entered the Chinese public eye. Many Chinese people are very interested in the survival and development of the ACP in the United States, which is also one of the reasons why I invited you to participate in the Mingde Dialogue in mid-October 2025.
I remember a very famous book called "Why the United States Has No Socialism" by the European scholar Werner Sombart. Have you read this book? I would like to ask you: Is this book outdated? What were the realities behind your founding of the ACP? What is your ultimate goal? How deep is the foundation of the American Communist Party in the United States?
Haz Al-Din: I think it's quite historically ironic because, from both internal and external perspectives, the United States is seen as the most anti-communist country in the world. However, if we step beyond the surface labels, we will find that communist sentiments are actually quite common among the American people. For example, some basic socialist principles: the government should serve the public interest, the people should strive for the social public interest, and help neighbors and those in need. These are common "American values" in the eyes of Americans.
There is also an interesting relationship between the United States and socialism, not only on the historical level - I mean the early European immigrants who arrived in North America established certain organizational forms that had a socialist color - but also on the concept of building a new community. This community is not based on blood, race, or ethnicity, but on shared values. I believe this concept also aligns with socialism. And the openness of the United States to the future, the mindset that is not bound by the past, means that communism has a special relationship in this country, mainly reflected in the imagination and possibility of building a new society and new community based on common principles and values rather than existing private interests.
Executive Chairman of the American Communist Party (ACP, established in 2024 by separating from the CPUSA) Haz Al-Din
From a practical perspective, the entry barrier for the American Communist Party for ordinary Americans remains high, as it requires a certain level of education. Understanding Marxism and the history of 20th-century communism itself is enough to make ordinary people feel distant from joining the party, so developing active participants is somewhat difficult.
However, in terms of the breadth of "sympathy and identification," we have observed internally: this is a communication issue. Once people understand us, become familiar with our work, especially know what our party does and what it is committed to, and personally contact our members, talk to us, and listen to our specific diagnosis and solution paths for American issues, they almost always give positive feedback. Our bottleneck lies in scale. Once we reach anyone, we can almost always spark interest, curiosity, gain sympathy, or even sincere support.
Of course, there are some groups within the political establishment and certain ideological opponents. But among ordinary Americans, we almost always leave a positive impression, which shows what communists are really like in the United States.
· Signs of breakdown of the American constitutional order are obvious; revolution cannot be ruled out under extreme circumstances
Wang Wen: It's very interesting. This is similar to the situation of the Communist Party of China in its early days, when we particularly emphasized loyalty, discipline, and other values.
The first time I heard about the ACP, which is the American Communist Party, my first impression was that Americans were thinking about the possibility of revolution. So I want to ask you: Could a socialist revolution happen in the United States? I haven't been to the United States for many years, and I know that this possibility may be very small, but from media reports, I think the current social situation in the United States is worrying. For example, it is well known that the public safety situation in the United States is very poor, racial discrimination still exists, and the wealth gap is widening.
Many of my American friends also say that more and more Americans are feeling despair about the "American Dream." So I want to ask you: Do you think that a socialist revolution could occur in the near future in the United States? Is this possibility existent?
Haz Al-Din: I think, in a way, this possibility exists, but I must add a caveat. According to historical experience, such as the background of socialist revolutions in Russia and China, a necessary prerequisite is: the central authority of the country has already split or weakened, and the entire system has experienced widespread systemic dysfunction, lacking a legitimate central power that can lead the country.
Therefore, I do not think that the collapse of the U.S. system will take the form of a socialist revolution at the current conditions. I think this possibility is very low and unrealistic. Technically speaking, it is almost impossible. Because there is simply not enough time to educate enough people, nor can we create a sense of urgency and necessity for achieving a socialist revolution.
But in a more extreme scenario, such as civil war in the United States, the collapse of federal government authority, the complete loss of public trust in the system, and the occurrence of systemic dysfunction, chaos, riots, gang struggles, and quasi-military organizations competing for control, in such a situation, I believe only the American Communist Party has the ability to unify the country and lead society. In our view, this is the possible direction of the future of the United States.
On October 5 local time, the U.S. Pentagon stated that approximately 200 California National Guard members had been deployed to Portland, Oregon, to support the Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) and other federal agencies in carrying out tasks.
If we look back at the development trends of the United States over the past decade, we can see that these signs of systemic breakdown are not "fantasy." The signs of the collapse of the American constitutional order have become very obvious. Therefore, the core task of our party is to build what Lenin called "dual power" (dual power) — that is, to establish a social organization base serving the public interest before the existing system collapses, whether it is community services, local leadership, or various social mechanisms. We want to build a new framework of authority so that we can step up when the federal government collapses. If this foundation is successfully built, we will be the most capable force to take over the country. We reject sectarianism, racism, tribalism, and religious fanaticism, and we are the only organization unconditionally committed to the public interest of the nation.
MAGA Movement is Turning Against Trump Himself
Wang Wen: Very interesting. You mentioned the word "civil war." Actually, recently, President Trump also mentioned this word again. Many American media are reporting the chaos and lawlessness occurring in cities across the United States. But another opinion is that President Trump seems to indeed hope to "save America," which is why the MAGA movement ("Make America Great Again") is a very hot topic in both China and the United States.
But the question is, in my view, Trump's MAGA is more like a cultural or political revolution, not a socialist revolution. So I want to ask, do you think Trump can save America? Is the decline of the United States still preventable? How long can the United States maintain its global hegemony?
Haz Al-Din: Simply put: no. I don't think the United States can be "saved." In our party's platform, it is clearly stated that the reconstitution of the United States is inevitable. The danger of the current U.S. political struggle lies in the fact that it has touched the legitimacy of the judicial system — and the judiciary is the only body authorized to interpret the Constitution. If the authority to interpret the Constitution itself is in dispute, it indicates that the country has no unified central power.
About the MAGA movement, we think it has significance for the American socialist movement not because we expect Trump to fulfill his promises to save the country, but because we observed during 2015–2016 that the MAGA movement presented a digital form of "popular sovereignty," or Rousseau's "general will." This will does not rely on the so-called "democratic system" of the United States, it bypasses the basic structures of U.S. hegemony, such as mainstream media, academia, and non-governmental organizations. It presents itself in a very direct way: the president posts on social media, and the masses interact directly, completely bypassing the "democratic system" itself. We believe that this is a new framework of popular sovereignty, whose content is undetermined.
On October 22 local time, the latest data from the U.S. Treasury showed that the total amount of federal government debt exceeded $38 trillion for the first time.
The current surface content of the MAGA movement is a basic Republican ideology, including anti-communism, hostility toward China and Iran, and strong support for Israel. But for us, the decisive factor is not the content, but the form — whether it can bypass the existing system and express public opinion. This form precisely provides a soil for spreading ideologies such as Marxism and communism.
If the experts and ideologues of the American democracy are lying — they lied about Hillary Clinton, they lied about historical facts. Then people will ask, are they also lying about the history of communism? Are they also lying about their perceptions of China, Iran, and Russia? We observed in the 2022 Ukraine-Russia conflict that the MAGA movement instinctively rejected the pro-Ukrainian narrative, indicating its great potential.
To summarize briefly, the MAGA movement is currently undergoing a profound transformation. I think it has become "redundant." It has achieved victory in the public consciousness, and therefore exposed all its internal contradictions.
Although the influence of traditional elites no longer appears in the form of media or institutions, we are now openly exposed to the "conspiracy dimension" of the power structure — that is, the things that are not publicly discussed. For example, the Jeffrey Epstein network, the influence of the Israeli lobbying group, the Zionist group, etc., these are becoming the "elephant in the room" in American politics and within the MAGA. Even Trump's posts on his own social media platform, Truth Social, cannot save him from public scrutiny. People keep asking: Why is the influence of Israel so significant? Why hasn't the Epstein list been released yet? Etc.
We are witnessing a turning point: the MAGA movement is beginning to turn against Trump himself. As communists, we believe this is an extremely critical moment, an opportunity for us to provide explanations.
Wang Wen: You mentioned many political evolutions related to international factors. I want to continue asking you from a global perspective. We all know that now in global politics, "anger," "conservatism," "closure" seem to be replacing "freedom" and "openness." This is the important background that, as you said, the global ideological trend is shifting towards conservatism and the right wing.
China is also closely watching this global ideological change. I would like to hear your views on the current changes in international political ideologies — is liberalism still present? Is conservatism rising? Or is socialism also rising in the West?
Haz Al-Din: I think there is a subtle "closeness" between the rising conservative sentiment and socialism. Their common point is that they both believe that the free trade system and the neoliberal global order are no longer sustainable and are heading towards an end.
Western governments are no longer able to fulfill the basic responsibility of prioritizing the public welfare of their citizens, but instead are constrained by the interests of super-rich elites and technocrats. However, I also believe that this conservative tide is worth being cautious about. I do not think that the liberal world order is "dead," but rather it is transforming.
In responding to the failure of the old order, different countries have chosen different paths. Some try to reform and elevate liberalism to a new stage, such as combining a global perspective with national conditions, coordinating the global and the national.
I think China is a typical example. China has not regressed into narrow xenophobia, but has harmoniously combined the global with the specific realities of each country's civilization and people.
However, on the other hand, there are also responses that have not made substantial criticisms of the "liberal global mechanism" itself. Here I refer to the imperial system centered on military aggression and financial control, which Michael Hudson calls "super imperialism." These responses only criticize on the surface, such as criticizing liberal culture, open attitudes, and so-called "political correctness."
The danger lies in the fact that the liberal world order is showing an increasingly naked hypocrisy — it tries to maintain the existing imperial system but no longer uses the veil of "universal human rights" and "democracy." For example, Trump increasingly defends the U.S. imperial control, but no longer mentions "global harmony" or "human rights," but rather openly emphasizes seizing resources from other countries and maintaining the U.S. as a "bully" in dominance.
Trump posted a video on his social media platform on October 14, stating that the U.S. military struck a "drug trafficking ship" near the coast of Venezuela, killing six people.
Therefore, we are at a turning point, and liberalism is being surpassed. Of course, certain elements of the old order will still be retained, but change is inevitable and it cannot remain as it is.
Wang Wen: It's very interesting. You just talked about the international environment and also mentioned that liberalism has been surpassed. I do feel that the current world's division is not only reflected in economic and trade friction, but also in the division in the ideological and intellectual fields.
So my next question is, as the leader of the American Communist Party, I am very curious about your plans for international cooperation and international development.
Haz Al-Din: We have made significant progress in establishing contacts with socialist and communist parties around the world. One of the most important points is our cooperation with the Russian Federation Communist Party (CPRF). I myself have visited Donbas three times.
Wang Wen: I went to Crimea three years ago. Yes, after the Ukraine crisis. In October 2022, I also went to Mariupol and Rostov-on-Don.
Haz Al-Din: Wow, you were there at that time. I have also been to Mariupol several times. Now the city is being rebuilt. Our International Secretary Christopher Helali has gone to Venezuela and many other places.
We are a member organization of the World Anti-Imperialist Platform, an international organization. I believe we have, or are in the process of becoming signatories of the Pyongyang Common Declaration, which is the core document of this platform.
We are making great efforts to gain formal recognition from the SolidNet (a network platform of communist and workers' parties) or the International Meeting of Communist and Workers' Parties (IMCWP). Currently, the Russian Federation Communist Party is providing us with great support. However, there are some forces that do not agree with our views on the Russian issue or our position against imperialism, and they are hostile towards our membership.
Nonetheless, even among these opponents, we are making some progress and gradually changing their views. Within the international socialist and communist movements, there are several hotly debated issues, focusing on the current geopolitical and anti-imperial definitions.
Many people consider China as a so-called "capitalist country" and Russia as an "imperialist country." Our party firmly denies these characterizations of China and Russia.
We adopt a less dogmatic understanding, based on factual analysis rather than labeling. We can observe the existing global financial system and also see the trends opposing it — the forces struggling for national sovereignty, ethnic self-determination, and alternative models of economic development. We believe that this contradiction is real. If as Marxists we do not have suitable conceptual tools to define these phenomena, then we should adjust our analytical methods, rather than arbitrarily label countries. I think that's my answer.
· What Can the American Communist Party Learn From the Chinese Communist Party?
Wang Wen: Hmm, very interesting. As you said, there are still many voices, media, and politicians who demonize the Communist Party of China. But on the other hand, more and more scholars and activists around the world are studying the Communist Party of China. So I don't know if you are also studying the history, evolution, and strength of the Communist Party of China. If possible, what can the American Communist Party learn from the Communist Party of China?
Haz Al-Din: Our party has institutionalized the study of the history of the Communist Party of China as a mandatory content for members. One reason is that we believe, objectively speaking, the Communist Party of China has made highly developed contributions to the "scientific method of Marxism-Leninism as a whole." The Communist Party of China has applied, adjusted, and advanced it in a way similar to how Lenin advanced Marxism, and Stalin and Mao advanced this tradition.
From a theoretical perspective alone, the Communist Party of China is very worthy of in-depth study — not to mention its specific historical practices. Because it has pioneered a new revolutionary adjustment and reform path, allowing Marxism-Leninism to develop without taking an adversarial political line. For example, after Stalin's death, Khrushchev promoted "de-Stalinization," completely denying Stalin's historical role, which triggered a trend of historical nihilism. The Soviet Union eventually collapsed, and while this was not the sole cause, it is undoubtedly one of the important factors.
China's experience is very interesting, because it continuously adds new content to the scientific system of Marxism-Leninism, from Mao Zedong Thought, Deng Xiaoping Theory, to subsequent intermediate theoretical achievements of subsequent leaders, and finally to Xi Jinping's Thought on Socialism with Chinese Characteristics for a New Era. We believe that this is the most advanced comprehensive development form of Marxism-Leninism to date.
Therefore, we believe that it is necessary to re-understand Marxism itself and incorporate the Communist Party of China and its theoretical achievements into this re-cognition. From a simpler perspective, today's China is the most dynamically growing major country in the world, and it is a socialist country led by the Communist Party. The Soviet Union no longer exists, and other socialist countries either no longer exist or are stagnant and underdeveloped.
Therefore, we believe that if we call ourselves "communists," the meaning of this term is not merely the historical imprint of the 20th century, but it is constantly shaped by the reality of China. In a way, this is the fundamental basis for us giving this title a realistic meaning.
Wang Wen: Very interesting. Your understanding of the history of the Communist Party of China surprises me. If you are in Beijing in a few days, I would like to take you to visit the History Exhibition Hall of the Communist Party of China, where the century-long history of the Party is displayed. You can gain a deeper understanding of the history of the Communist Party of China. It's very interesting. You also mentioned President Xi Jinping and Xi Jinping's Thought on Socialism with Chinese Characteristics for a New Era. I'm curious, how did you learn about Xi Jinping's Thought on Socialism with Chinese Characteristics for a New Era? Can you talk about your understanding of it?
Haz Al-Din: I have read "Xi Jinping on Governance," but I also understand it by observing the specific historical stage represented by Xi Jinping's Thought on Socialism with Chinese Characteristics for a New Era. My core understanding of Xi Jinping's Thought on Socialism with Chinese Characteristics for a New Era is that although socialist principles do not directly act on cultural, economic, or social fields, they still guide the development of the country indirectly. I think this is an important experience of Deng Xiaoping's theory, that is, to provide overall guidance for socialist development without forcibly indoctrinating ideology.
But I think the novelty of Xi Jinping's Thought on Socialism with Chinese Characteristics for a New Era lies in its exploration of the spiritual and moral dimensions of socialist construction. Although as a materialist, saying this sounds a bit special, I can't find a more appropriate expression than "spiritual and moral dimensions." Xi Jinping's Thought on Socialism with Chinese Characteristics for a New Era emphasizes that the development of the country, industrial development, economic development, and social civilization construction should be coordinated with core values and moral orientation. Especially in the current information age, people's "consciousness" has become a decisive factor in shaping the national and social landscape. In this context, the improvement of the spiritual and cultural level and overall quality of the Chinese people has also become an important part of socialist construction.
I think this is an unprecedented contribution to Marxism. Early Marxists did not face such urgent "spiritual and moral" issues. Xi Jinping's Thought on Socialism with Chinese Characteristics for a New Era is precisely responding to this global, regional, and economic environmental shift. It is not only the most advanced extension of Marxism, but also the most mature theoretical synthesis result of humanity's understanding of the new era. In the United States, we have not yet truly understood what this new era is — the intersection of the information age, culture, civilization, ecological awareness, and the essence of human nature. And Xi Jinping's Thought on Socialism with Chinese Characteristics for a New Era is the theoretical achievement that we, as American communists, highly value.
Wang Wen: Thank you for your in-depth study of Xi Jinping's Thought on Socialism with Chinese Characteristics for a New Era. I also want to briefly share some of my views with you. I think that in the past hundred years, the Communist Party of China has taken on different historical missions in different periods.
The mission of Chairman Mao was to establish a new China. After 1949, Chairman Mao focused on building the basic system of a socialist state. As you said, from 1978 onwards, Deng Xiaoping's mission was to promote economic development. The core of the "reform and opening-up" policy was economic construction. So it can be clearly seen that from the late 1970s to the early 21st century, China's economy grew rapidly at a rate of more than 10%.
I think the focus of Xi Jinping's Thought on Socialism with Chinese Characteristics for a New Era is "high-quality development." We certainly cannot deny the contributions of the Deng Xiaoping era, but there were also many problems during that period, such as the ecological pollution, corruption, and the wealth gap you mentioned earlier. The mission of the Xi Jinping era is to comprehensively solve these problems. Therefore, we have promoted poverty alleviation, ecological protection, and at the same time, we have promoted the national rejuvenation. However, we are also facing strategic deterrence from the United States. Therefore, for China, this is a very comprehensive mission. What you said earlier is correct — Xi Jinping's Thought on Socialism with Chinese Characteristics for a New Era is a concentrated embodiment of a "comprehensive development concept."
Therefore, my last question is about the future. We are currently promoting a "2050 Research Project," which is based on the United Nations' 2030 Sustainable Development Goals (SDGs). However, the reality is that the challenges facing the world are very severe, and the 2030 goals may not be achievable. Therefore, we have launched the "2050 Outlook," hoping to contribute a Chinese solution to human development after 2030. The Communist Party of China has clearly stated that by 2050, it aims to build a modern socialist power and achieve the great rejuvenation of the Chinese nation.
Therefore, I want to ask you, as a young person, does the American Communist Party have similar long-term goals? For example, how do you view the United States in 2050?
Haz Al-Din: Of course, we are not considering long-term development. Before the establishment of the ACP, the "Infrared" media movement and collective proposed a slogan in 2021: "CPUSA 2036." The meaning of this slogan is that by 2036, we hope that the CPUSA can become a revived mass party with millions of supporters. We did not set the goal of "seizing power" or "achieving socialism" in the United States at that time, but rather hoped that the American communist movement could revive. Of course, this is a very ambitious long-term task.
Now, the ACP inherits this goal. We do not expect to have millions of supporters in just a few years; nor do we expect to seize power within decades. That is unrealistic. We just want to be on the right track, moving forward toward this arduous and long-term goal.
Therefore, we are not in a hurry. I often tell those anxious and exhausted comrades that this is not a sprint, but a marathon.
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